The table I gave previously was based on information for Iain Howell's "Guide to Mount Kenya and Kilimanjaro", but I agree that the translation to rock grades seemed to be a bit out. I have edited this based on my own experience on Mount Kenya, but keep in mind that these translations are always difficult, especially for alpine grades.
For example, the Normal Route on Nelion is given IV- in East African grade, and the hardest rock moves were about 5.8 (American) or 5 (French). An overall alpine grade of AD+ or D seemed appropriate.
I've updated the Mt Kenya coordinates based on both the Google interactive map, and on Mike Savage's 1:50000 Mt Kenya map that has a UTM / WGS-84 grid.
If you look on the Google interactive map now the relative positions of Mt Kenya (i.e. Nelion and Batian) and Point Lenana are correct, but there is still a problem with Point Lenana and it doesn't end up being anywhere near the correct position. It's too far to the south-east.
Where did you get your coordinates from? I get for Lenana:
-0.15192
37.31215
cheers,
Ben
P.S. I've updated the Mount Kenya page so that all references to Point Lenana hyperlink though to your Summitpost page. Maybe you can do the same in reverse, since these pages are closely related?
As mentioned before, the edited table is a rough guideline based on my own experience on Mt Kenya. The hardest moves on the Normal Route on Nelion are on the De Graafs variation pitch and there is no way that these are 5.5. A grade of 5.7 to 5.8 seems fair. The majority of the other pitches are, however, much easier and a confident party will move really fast on these.
There are in fact only 3 pitches with any significant technical challenges:
1. Pitch 4: Mackinder's Chimney or the "Rabbit hole" variation.
2. Pitch 12: The De Graafs variation - best pitch of the route!
3. Pitch 14: Tricky crossing of the Amphitheater.
Bear in mind also that this is an alpine scale mountain and you need to factor in not only the difficulty of the individual climbing moves, but also the fact that you're climbing at altitude, possibly in big boots and wearing a pack, and will be having quite a long day out.
I felt that the technical crux of the climb was the traverse, which I'd call YDS 5.7 or so (I followed the pins & slings I saw along the way; Gordon took a slightly different line & found a slightly easier way, I think). deGraaf's variation & the crack leading up to the ledge below the One O'Clock Gully were slightly easier, maybe 5.6. I would not call the cruxes of the climb 5.5.
I think that your translation chart is not accurate.
I haven't been to mt. Kenya but then I've Benn climbing the franch alps quite often and for example a typical rock grade for D/D+ route is around 5.10 American scale = (6a franch scale) witch is far above the grades you mention in your chart.
There are several comparison charts in the web that can help you with a more accurate chart.
The table I gave previously was based on information for Iain Howell's "Guide to Mount Kenya and Kilimanjaro", but I agree that the translation to rock grades seemed to be a bit out. I have edited this based on my own experience on Mount Kenya, but keep in mind that these translations are always difficult, especially for alpine grades.
For example, the Normal Route on Nelion is given IV- in East African grade, and the hardest rock moves were about 5.8 (American) or 5 (French). An overall alpine grade of AD+ or D seemed appropriate.
I think you may want to check the summit coordinates of Mt Kenya. They seem to be a bit off. Lenana ends up to the east of Mt. Kenya if you look at the interactive map.
I've updated the Mt Kenya coordinates based on both the Google interactive map, and on Mike Savage's 1:50000 Mt Kenya map that has a UTM / WGS-84 grid.
If you look on the Google interactive map now the relative positions of Mt Kenya (i.e. Nelion and Batian) and Point Lenana are correct, but there is still a problem with Point Lenana and it doesn't end up being anywhere near the correct position. It's too far to the south-east.
Where did you get your coordinates from? I get for Lenana:
-0.15192
37.31215
cheers,
Ben
P.S. I've updated the Mount Kenya page so that all references to Point Lenana hyperlink though to your Summitpost page. Maybe you can do the same in reverse, since these pages are closely related?
From what I can tell, the conversions shown here do not correspond to those given in Cameron Burns' guide ('Kilimanjaro & Mt. Kenya, A Climging and Trekking Guide, P. 56), the one advertised on this page/site) as well as Iain Allan's (The Mountain Club of Kenya Guide to Mount Kenya and Kilimanjaro, P. 49).
For instance, both of the guides seem to suggest that East African grade I corresponds to 5.1-5.2 YDS, & East African IV corresponds to 5.5 YDS. As your chart shows East African IV (difficulty of the normal route up Nelion) to be equivalent to YDS 5.8, this is a major difference in difficulty!
Wanting to do this route in less than 2 months, I want to make sure I know the difficulty of what I'll be attempting! Have you climbed in the US enough to have a feel for the difficulties in the YDS system?
As mentioned before, the edited table is a rough guideline based on my own experience on Mt Kenya. The hardest moves on the Normal Route on Nelion are on the De Graafs variation pitch and there is no way that these are 5.5. A grade of 5.7 to 5.8 seems fair. The majority of the other pitches are, however, much easier and a confident party will move really fast on these.
There are in fact only 3 pitches with any significant technical challenges:
1. Pitch 4: Mackinder's Chimney or the "Rabbit hole" variation.
2. Pitch 12: The De Graafs variation - best pitch of the route!
3. Pitch 14: Tricky crossing of the Amphitheater.
Bear in mind also that this is an alpine scale mountain and you need to factor in not only the difficulty of the individual climbing moves, but also the fact that you're climbing at altitude, possibly in big boots and wearing a pack, and will be having quite a long day out.
I felt that the technical crux of the climb was the traverse, which I'd call YDS 5.7 or so (I followed the pins & slings I saw along the way; Gordon took a slightly different line & found a slightly easier way, I think). deGraaf's variation & the crack leading up to the ledge below the One O'Clock Gully were slightly easier, maybe 5.6. I would not call the cruxes of the climb 5.5.
I saw there were links to various guides for climbing Mt. Kenya. I wanted to contribute the link to the guides at TrekMtKenya.com. They do various Montains in Kenya as well as, Kilimanjaro. We climbed with them in February 2015 and found them to do a good job and be well respected among their other guides.
Global warming was not caused by man. It is part of the natural process of cyclical climate change. We are currently still in the era when the ice age is ending. This is also why the glaciers, which are a remnant of the Ice Age, are receding. Mountain glaciers don't actually melt. Most of the loss is caused by sublimation, which is greater with lower temperatures and more sunshine. This changes the ratio of the ablation zone to the snow convergence zone. The consequence of the warming of the planet is a new height stratification of the temperature, when it is warmer near the earth's surface, but on the contrary it is colder at heights above 5000 meters. Therefore, there is less snowfall and more sunshine. This means that more ice sublimates than is added by snowfall, and the mass balance is therefore negative. But not all glaciers are retreating. Where there is more precipitation and higher humidity, glaciers are stable or even growing, as is the case with some glaciers in Norway and Patagonia.
ben jammin - Oct 3, 2005 5:24 am - Voted 10/10
Untitled CommentHi Roy,
The table I gave previously was based on information for Iain Howell's "Guide to Mount Kenya and Kilimanjaro", but I agree that the translation to rock grades seemed to be a bit out. I have edited this based on my own experience on Mount Kenya, but keep in mind that these translations are always difficult, especially for alpine grades.
For example, the Normal Route on Nelion is given IV- in East African grade, and the hardest rock moves were about 5.8 (American) or 5 (French). An overall alpine grade of AD+ or D seemed appropriate.
cheers,
Ben
ben jammin - Oct 12, 2005 4:40 am - Voted 10/10
Untitled CommentHi Corax,
Thanks for pointing out this discrepancy.
I've updated the Mt Kenya coordinates based on both the Google interactive map, and on Mike Savage's 1:50000 Mt Kenya map that has a UTM / WGS-84 grid.
If you look on the Google interactive map now the relative positions of Mt Kenya (i.e. Nelion and Batian) and Point Lenana are correct, but there is still a problem with Point Lenana and it doesn't end up being anywhere near the correct position. It's too far to the south-east.
Where did you get your coordinates from? I get for Lenana:
-0.15192
37.31215
cheers,
Ben
P.S. I've updated the Mount Kenya page so that all references to Point Lenana hyperlink though to your Summitpost page. Maybe you can do the same in reverse, since these pages are closely related?
ben jammin - Nov 3, 2005 4:46 am - Voted 10/10
Untitled CommentHi Dirk,
you're right that the grade conversions shown here don't correspond to those in the literature.
See my previous comments below for the rationale.
As mentioned before, the edited table is a rough guideline based on my own experience on Mt Kenya. The hardest moves on the Normal Route on Nelion are on the De Graafs variation pitch and there is no way that these are 5.5. A grade of 5.7 to 5.8 seems fair. The majority of the other pitches are, however, much easier and a confident party will move really fast on these.
There are in fact only 3 pitches with any significant technical challenges:
1. Pitch 4: Mackinder's Chimney or the "Rabbit hole" variation.
2. Pitch 12: The De Graafs variation - best pitch of the route!
3. Pitch 14: Tricky crossing of the Amphitheater.
Bear in mind also that this is an alpine scale mountain and you need to factor in not only the difficulty of the individual climbing moves, but also the fact that you're climbing at altitude, possibly in big boots and wearing a pack, and will be having quite a long day out.
Hope you have a good one on the mountain!
cheers,
Ben
ben jammin - Feb 7, 2006 2:31 am - Voted 10/10
Untitled CommentHi Diggler,
now that you've successfully been up the route, can you give some feedback on the grades?
How would you assess the technical difficulty of the crux De Graaf's variation pitch in YDS grades?
cheers,
Ben
Diggler - Feb 7, 2006 1:54 pm - Voted 10/10
Untitled CommentI felt that the technical crux of the climb was the traverse, which I'd call YDS 5.7 or so (I followed the pins & slings I saw along the way; Gordon took a slightly different line & found a slightly easier way, I think). deGraaf's variation & the crack leading up to the ledge below the One O'Clock Gully were slightly easier, maybe 5.6. I would not call the cruxes of the climb 5.5.
Great, well protected climbing, at any rate!
duxe1975 - Nov 16, 2004 2:43 am - Voted 5/10
Untitled CommentHi!
I think that your translation chart is not accurate.
I haven't been to mt. Kenya but then I've Benn climbing the franch alps quite often and for example a typical rock grade for D/D+ route is around 5.10 American scale = (6a franch scale) witch is far above the grades you mention in your chart.
There are several comparison charts in the web that can help you with a more accurate chart.
Cheers
Roy
ben jammin - Oct 3, 2005 5:24 am - Voted 10/10
Untitled CommentHi Roy,
The table I gave previously was based on information for Iain Howell's "Guide to Mount Kenya and Kilimanjaro", but I agree that the translation to rock grades seemed to be a bit out. I have edited this based on my own experience on Mount Kenya, but keep in mind that these translations are always difficult, especially for alpine grades.
For example, the Normal Route on Nelion is given IV- in East African grade, and the hardest rock moves were about 5.8 (American) or 5 (French). An overall alpine grade of AD+ or D seemed appropriate.
cheers,
Ben
Corax - Oct 11, 2005 7:09 pm - Voted 10/10
Untitled CommentI think you may want to check the summit coordinates of Mt Kenya. They seem to be a bit off. Lenana ends up to the east of Mt. Kenya if you look at the interactive map.
I had:
-00.1533
37.3178
Thanks, JC.
ben jammin - Oct 12, 2005 4:40 am - Voted 10/10
Untitled CommentHi Corax,
Thanks for pointing out this discrepancy.
I've updated the Mt Kenya coordinates based on both the Google interactive map, and on Mike Savage's 1:50000 Mt Kenya map that has a UTM / WGS-84 grid.
If you look on the Google interactive map now the relative positions of Mt Kenya (i.e. Nelion and Batian) and Point Lenana are correct, but there is still a problem with Point Lenana and it doesn't end up being anywhere near the correct position. It's too far to the south-east.
Where did you get your coordinates from? I get for Lenana:
-0.15192
37.31215
cheers,
Ben
P.S. I've updated the Mount Kenya page so that all references to Point Lenana hyperlink though to your Summitpost page. Maybe you can do the same in reverse, since these pages are closely related?
Diggler - Nov 2, 2005 6:41 pm - Voted 10/10
Untitled CommentFrom what I can tell, the conversions shown here do not correspond to those given in Cameron Burns' guide ('Kilimanjaro & Mt. Kenya, A Climging and Trekking Guide, P. 56), the one advertised on this page/site) as well as Iain Allan's (The Mountain Club of Kenya Guide to Mount Kenya and Kilimanjaro, P. 49).
For instance, both of the guides seem to suggest that East African grade I corresponds to 5.1-5.2 YDS, & East African IV corresponds to 5.5 YDS. As your chart shows East African IV (difficulty of the normal route up Nelion) to be equivalent to YDS 5.8, this is a major difference in difficulty!
Wanting to do this route in less than 2 months, I want to make sure I know the difficulty of what I'll be attempting! Have you climbed in the US enough to have a feel for the difficulties in the YDS system?
ben jammin - Nov 3, 2005 4:46 am - Voted 10/10
Untitled CommentHi Dirk,
you're right that the grade conversions shown here don't correspond to those in the literature.
See my previous comments below for the rationale.
As mentioned before, the edited table is a rough guideline based on my own experience on Mt Kenya. The hardest moves on the Normal Route on Nelion are on the De Graafs variation pitch and there is no way that these are 5.5. A grade of 5.7 to 5.8 seems fair. The majority of the other pitches are, however, much easier and a confident party will move really fast on these.
There are in fact only 3 pitches with any significant technical challenges:
1. Pitch 4: Mackinder's Chimney or the "Rabbit hole" variation.
2. Pitch 12: The De Graafs variation - best pitch of the route!
3. Pitch 14: Tricky crossing of the Amphitheater.
Bear in mind also that this is an alpine scale mountain and you need to factor in not only the difficulty of the individual climbing moves, but also the fact that you're climbing at altitude, possibly in big boots and wearing a pack, and will be having quite a long day out.
Hope you have a good one on the mountain!
cheers,
Ben
ben jammin - Feb 7, 2006 2:31 am - Voted 10/10
Untitled CommentHi Diggler,
now that you've successfully been up the route, can you give some feedback on the grades?
How would you assess the technical difficulty of the crux De Graaf's variation pitch in YDS grades?
cheers,
Ben
Diggler - Feb 7, 2006 1:54 pm - Voted 10/10
Untitled CommentI felt that the technical crux of the climb was the traverse, which I'd call YDS 5.7 or so (I followed the pins & slings I saw along the way; Gordon took a slightly different line & found a slightly easier way, I think). deGraaf's variation & the crack leading up to the ledge below the One O'Clock Gully were slightly easier, maybe 5.6. I would not call the cruxes of the climb 5.5.
Great, well protected climbing, at any rate!
hgrapid - Jul 12, 2009 1:03 pm - Hasn't voted
CoordinatesCoordinates are slightly off - missing by 0.12 miles
CJ - Jun 21, 2015 4:36 pm - Hasn't voted
additional guide contactsI saw there were links to various guides for climbing Mt. Kenya. I wanted to contribute the link to the guides at TrekMtKenya.com. They do various Montains in Kenya as well as, Kilimanjaro. We climbed with them in February 2015 and found them to do a good job and be well respected among their other guides.
ben jammin - Jun 27, 2015 2:09 pm - Voted 10/10
Re: additional guide contactsThanks, CJ.
I've added the link to the "Guides, Outfitters and Porters" section on the Mt Kenya page.
cheers,
ben
Magiosa - Mar 9, 2024 11:53 pm - Hasn't voted
Magiosa - profesional meteorologistGlobal warming was not caused by man. It is part of the natural process of cyclical climate change. We are currently still in the era when the ice age is ending. This is also why the glaciers, which are a remnant of the Ice Age, are receding. Mountain glaciers don't actually melt. Most of the loss is caused by sublimation, which is greater with lower temperatures and more sunshine. This changes the ratio of the ablation zone to the snow convergence zone. The consequence of the warming of the planet is a new height stratification of the temperature, when it is warmer near the earth's surface, but on the contrary it is colder at heights above 5000 meters. Therefore, there is less snowfall and more sunshine. This means that more ice sublimates than is added by snowfall, and the mass balance is therefore negative. But not all glaciers are retreating. Where there is more precipitation and higher humidity, glaciers are stable or even growing, as is the case with some glaciers in Norway and Patagonia.